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I suck at violin
| Message Board > General Chitchat > I suck at violin |
| Tim-Bitchfork User Info... | Hey, I have a violin kicking around that I plan to start seriously learning, I got the bow some Rosen and can actually play very simple tunes like hot-cross-buns (laugh it up). Right now I am just seeing what I can pick up on my own before I get lessons. I've been playing drums for 12 years and guitar for 5 so I picking some stuff up fast from guitar. My problem right now is tuning. The strings on the violin are the stock strings, I thought for a while I was tuning the violin right (with a digital tuner) but it turns out I was tuning an octave lower. I found a website that plays the actual notes the strings need to be and I matched the strings to that with the digital tuner. I tune my violin the same way I tune my floyd-rose bridge electric guitar: I tune from the headstock end starting from the outside strings to the inward ones, then fine tune from the bridge end, outside strings to inward ones. My problem is the second I let go of the wooden peg on the headstock when it's the right note, it drops like 4 notes. I push the peg sideways into it's hole to make it stop slipping and it will slowly drop a flat or a whole note by itself. I know for a fact my violin is not a good one and is closer to a beginner level one than anything. Is there something wrong with the violin? Are the strings too tight or need stretching? I am not sure what I am doing wrong and would appreciate any help from the gurus! Once I can tune and play some things I will get some lessons and stop bothering you all :). Thanks a lot! Tim - Sun, 24 Dec 2006 9:23pm | ||
| Rex User Info... | usually a violin should have a set of fine tuners right below the bridge. They kinda look like 4 screws with flat tops. Get close to the note with the pegs and then touch up with those guys and you should be good to go. - Mon, 25 Dec 2006 1:37pm | ||
| Tim-Bitchfork User Info... | Yup, thats what I've been doing, the wooden pegs on the headstock end still slip a note or two when i put them in correct tuning before I even have a chance to use the fine tuners. I push the wooden pegs in more into their holes and it kinda helps but the tuning still drops a flat or a note, right away. The pegs can't keep enough friction to stay in tune. I just got some DiAddario Prelude medium tension steel core strings for xmas so maybe that will help? Any other ideas? Thanks man. - Mon, 25 Dec 2006 2:30pm Edited: Mon, 25 Dec 2006 2:36pm | ||
| andymica User Info... | The tuning pegs are very touchy just make sure they're in there tight, push in as you tune. If not you'll have to talk to someone who plays....Daniel Lapp?? - Mon, 25 Dec 2006 3:03pm Edited: Mon, 25 Dec 2006 3:04pm | ||
| sati User Info... | Yeah, pushing the pegs in as you tune takes a certain knack - twisting and very gently coersing them in. Thats important and usually works, but pegs react to changes in humidity, so its kind of complicated Soon you'll get a feel for the wood and it'll get easier. Some people take rosin or chalk to them to give them some stick, but the grit in addition to the constant forcing can damage your pegs. You can get special peg drops from music stores which is made especially for that type of problem, and its a lot safer. But if its really bad, I guess you might just have to take the instrument in to get those babies resized. And just in case you're new to stringed instruments and not aware, treat your bow gently too. That means, loosen the hair when you're done playing. Even cheap violins are very sensitive instruments. - Mon, 25 Dec 2006 3:28pm Edited: Mon, 25 Dec 2006 3:44pm | ||
| Tim-Bitchfork User Info... | Hey you guys are awesome! I'm glad to hear that I am just ignorant and that the violin is probably fine. I've never played a bowed instrument so I didn't know about loosening the bow after playing, thanks for that! I probably left mine tight for 2 days!! eeek. Cool, I'll keep playing around with it, I'm just playing it safe so I don't break the pegs, but I guess I will carefully push harder and try that. My sister got me strings and resin for xmas so my bow works way better now! I havn't changed the strings tho, are they the same as guitar as far as how often you change the strings (I change my gtar strings about every month or two months)? Thanks again! - Mon, 25 Dec 2006 3:38pm | ||
| Sati User Info... | Bows are made of wood and horse hair so they need a break. Like I said, they're very sensitive. And if you have a cheap violin, don't bother getting your bow "re-haired" because it'll probably just be cheaper to buy a new one. How often you change strings depends on how much and how hard you play, but I think every few months should be enough. (And FYI, the way I was taught to tune is from the second string - the "A" string. You nail that one, and then you learn where your fingers go to tune the others from it.) Also, I just can't help myself, but I'd suggest at least getting some tips on technique before you form bad habits. With the neck & shoulders doing so much rigid work, its pretty important to train your muscles to take the right form early so you can relax your arms & wrists and really get into the instrument. Have a great time, I'm envious. Its an awesome instrument. - Mon, 25 Dec 2006 4:02pm Edited: Mon, 25 Dec 2006 4:08pm | ||
| Gman User Info... | Some people suggest rubbing a bit of rosin dust on the pegs if they slip. - Mon, 25 Dec 2006 10:51pm | ||
| Tim-Bitchfork User Info... | Hey cool, it still slips a bit but I think I am getting the hang of it now, I took your advice Sati, and read a lot about positioning of the arm/chin/violin to make sure I don't learn this the wrong way, I've done that with guitar before and regretted it. I will get proper lessons soon I hope. I figured out the perfect 5th tuning from string to string using the same thing I used to do with guitar. Thanks for all the tips, I think I am on my way to learning some cool stuff, I can play some xmas song I know now and I am just practicing some note matching with my piano by just doing some simple scales to match on the violin. My pitch is decent so I am getting that quick. But yea, proper lessons would be a great idea. - Tue, 26 Dec 2006 12:16pm | ||
| maniac User Info... | You can always get reasonable priced lessons through UVic's School of Music. The students teach on Wednesdays, if I remember correctly. - Mon, 1 Jan 2007 7:26pm | ||
| J. Peatman User Info... | Something that also helps to get a perfect pitch is working with a little tuning flute (I think it's called), like the ones for guitar. Someone got me a decent old violin for $ 10 a while ago. It's missing three of the fine tuners but the pegs work outstanding. Bow needs to be rehaired but I can't really be bothered with that right now... I kind of regret I haven't been playing it too much so far. I bought a mute for it but am still kind of apprehensive about playing it in my apartment because of my lack of skills and the audial results of that. Maybe going up Mount Doug at night and rock out is the best thing haha. Oh well, at least I got the Dutch National Anthem and the Hobbit Theme from LotR down so far. I'd like to consider taking lessons for sure, only thing is that I am not too interested in music theory and notation...would that be an issue, even with low key Uvic student instructions? - Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:46am | ||
| nicola User Info... | Hey Tim, Looks like you're getting some good advice from Sati but I'll put in my 2 cents. Some violins have plastic tuning pegs, which will always slip. That's more common with the older/cheaper makes and children's sizes. If the slipping is a problem on wooden pegs, get a music store to use the drops on them, it's way safer than anything like rosin (if you use too much rosin, they'll stick- and you'll break strings). If you're playing a used violin, the pegs could be worn out (too small for the hole) but a music store can tell you that. When restringing the instrument remember to always do one string at a time. DO NOT REMOVE ALL THE STRINGS AT THE SAME TIME! The reason for this is that the bridge is floating- meaning not glued down and you don't want to lose it's spot. The other thing you need to think about is the sound post. By relieving pressure on the top of the violin, the post inside is likely to fall with any small bump (not good). So replace the strings one at a time and you'll be fine. I find it easier than restringing a guitar (you dont have to cut the strings). Good Luck! - Wed, 3 Jan 2007 1:59pm | ||
| Sati User Info... | ^^^ I'm glad you chimed in, because I'm no expert, and thems some good advice. Hey Mr Bitchfork, its good to hear that you plowed forward & didn't lose enthusiasm for it! Its a challenging instrument and like JPeatman hinted at, a totally obnoxious thing to do to your family & neighbours at first, so a lot of people give up pretty quick. (Btw, you could buy a mute, but a wooden clothespin on the bridge also does the trick. I remember entire orchestras of kids sportin those... oh, we were such geeks) I think a cheap bow only runs about $25 or so. Pitch pipes are less than $10. And don't forget shoulder pads or rests. About lessons, I think the "suzuki method" emphasizes training by ear. And I wasn't exactly pushing you to get lessons, just to at least look into proper positioning, and it sounds like you did that. BUT.. after lamenting the loss of so many of my favorite local musicians to tendonitis-type injuries, please everyone, take that stuff seriously! I'm not sure but I think violin can be one of the more brutal because of the exacting finger work & awkward stance. I remember doing zillions of exercises trying to loosen up my wrists so my bow-work could sound less screachy & more fluid and its damn near impossible to get any decent vibratto (with your left hand) when you're all stiff. Anyone seen Jesse Zubot play lately? Not that I get to see a lot of violinists, but he's such an adventurous player, its awesome to watch him these days. He totally molests that thing! - Wed, 3 Jan 2007 4:31pm Edited: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 4:36pm | ||
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