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Dec.1st, Sunset Room, speakers and movies and bands, oh my!
| Message Board > Show Reviews > Dec.1st, Sunset Room, speakers and movies and bands, oh my! |
| darcy User Info... | So I did come a bit late, but I got there as a presentation on, I think, "anarchism in a nutshell". Lots of talk on different tactics and actions, aswell as bands, and issues that face many people. Perhaps this was talked about earlier, but I would have really liked to have heard more on sort of, the theoretical part of anarchism, you know? How does it view the state? workers? Groups like the NDP? ectect. Perhaps next time. The movies were all pretty cool, and really raised a lot of good points. I really thought about the one man in the video who was talking about marches and property destruction. I've had this discussion many times with people at different events. It's almost like a double-edged sword. On the one hand, yes, you are, in a way, "smashing" a part of oppresion (be it Mcd;s, so on and so forth), and it is a way to get a point across and be noticed (for better or for worse), the other part comes in when you think about who is going to clean that up? Are Bill Gates and Ronald McDonald gonna come down and clean up the mess themselves? No, it's going to be a working brother or sister who get that task. So on the hand hand, I do support and would defend someone who displayed this tactic, but I would be critical of it, and perhaps think of a better way to express that rage. the bands. WP. We played a new set, and I played an old guitar. Haha. I thought it sounded pretty good. Course, I think Sonata Artica sounds pretty good. So whatevs. MBL. Awesome set. The songs were all really tight sounding. I really dug the way the bass and the bass drum really pounded the beats into me. And the guitar and vocals just made you wanna rage. Awesome set. I then went home to write an essay about Cultural relativism. My essay sucks.. - Sat, 2 Dec 2006 11:54am | ||
| jeff User Info... | i also came late, but early enought to see some movies and some speakers pretty good i liked the part on anarcho punk and what its about. Wayne Powerman ruled the house, ive needed to see them for so long, i like the new songs they rule. also i liked how you covered one of MBLs songs, that made my night MBL, i thought it was hella rad, i had so much fun and im pretty sure it sounded pretty good people seemed to had fun. thanks everyone that came, those who missed this i feel sorry for you - Sat, 2 Dec 2006 12:59pm | ||
| rip skinny User Info... | it was a pretty cool show. - Sat, 2 Dec 2006 3:47pm | ||
| tyler User Info... | the show waS fun but my only problem when was that guy told cordel to clean up or get out..like i dont like blood but why should he leave..if fucking diy is gonna come to play the show totally fucking drunk? but yaeh..i dont know anything about anarcho stuff but the speakers were better than the show i thought but i have some questions...what is defined as working class becuase i saw lots of "working class rules" esq things in those movies..but arent hELLA rich people workers?..and why do anarchos use red and black as colours? arent those also the facist colours? food is good mbl rules - Sat, 2 Dec 2006 9:59pm | ||
| Jesspsycho User Info... | Why should he leave? Because people are sick and tired of him thinking he so punk rock that he has to spray his blood all over everyone at every frikkin show. Sorry dude but most people really don't like having someone else's blood sprayed on them everytime they go to an all-ager of all places. Just my opinion. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 1:02am | ||
| ScumFucBondage User Info... | Hey I thoguht it was fucing sweet, killer bands played, and blood rul;es sweetest rock-out tool. Wayne Powerman rocked my ass till deat hman, that was seriously fucing killer, and mind between the lines was fucing swet too. So was DIY that was lots of fun. And too everyone that hates me, fucing sweet, i suck. let's rock. oh yeah about the anarcho stuff....i'm too simple minded to liek that, cool yo uall do that shit, no my thng but whatever. I like beer and mcdonalds. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 2:14am | ||
| NOISE NOT BOMBS User Info... | people that were having fun left the show because of cordels behavior. No I am not gonna say he can't do it, but seriousely have enough fucking respect for other peop;le that we can all get together and have fun. Jeffs little sister got sick from the blood, and had to leave, she likes seeing her brothers band play, and this is a good thing that shopuld be encouraged.... as for your questions... Origionally red was used as a sybol for socailism, before MARX, and both anarchists and other socailists used red flags. Red was sopose to symbolise all the people that died in the class war. After the split of the first international, anarchist socailists quit using the red, as it was coopted by the marxists, and other statist communist groups... so they used a black flag, to sybolise layers of dried blood from years of people dying at the hands of their governments. Anarchism too a different turn in the 1960s, one that whent away from the class struggle, and worker movement, towards people that were talking about gender, about using violence, about race struggles, indigenouse struggles and so on... Union anarchists and other class war anarchists (socailist anarhists) adopted a red and black flag, to show the importance of the class struggle in anarchism, not saying that race and gender and so on were unimportant, but rather saying all were connected to class struggle. the red sybolising the class war, the black, all anarchism. Only socailist anarchists use a red and black flag. Most other anarchists use the black flag, and some eco-anarchists and primitivists use a green and black flag to show that they feel the enviroment is more important than workers rights, the queer anarchists some times use a pink and black flag as well.... Also some Nihilists who are anarchists use a yello and black flag... As for working class, it refers to any wage earners, that are not in controle of hiring and fireing, and have mno real authority at their places of work. Some one making food at a fast food restaraunt, that they will not eat, some one laying foundations for hopuses they could never afford, people who make shit for others, not cause they want to, but cause if they don't, the people in controle (employing class) would just let them starve.... people are forced into work, because they need the money, even though others have too much. Most of the people that are in management and owners do little actual work, compared to the workers, and most get paid way more that the workers.... If you wanna know more about it just ask and I will d coffee with you. Right now my eyes are super sore, and I am having trouble reading.... Good Night all, and thank you. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 2:29am | ||
| Andrew User Info... | missed the anarchist stuff. sux, i wanted to get a bit of education on the subject but i had to work until 5 and jump thru some hoops. bryce mark and tyler of course yuo all rule but sorry to say, not as much as darcy lol. it was rad to see u guys play againg. the intros and such were killer. so was blind :) - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 3:20am Edited: Sun, 3 Dec 2006 3:28am | ||
| ScumFucBondage User Info... | Yeah man, sucks bout your eyes, hope yo uget better. And yeah I know what I do is imoral and shit...but, I'm not gonna argue I do what I do. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 9:24am | ||
| Brian VIHC User Info... | The red and black flag has been used by anarchists since the 30's at least. The horizontally split red/black flag is seen held by anarchists in hundreds of photos and hours of film footage from the period. The fascists in Spain and elsewhere co-opted similar symbolism and use of colour because they wanted to emulate the success of socialists and anarchists. If you're talking about the German flag during the 30's and 40's they used red white and black because those were the original colours of the imperial German flag and there's no relation in terms of symbolism. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 10:52am | ||
| Jesspsycho User Info... | ScumFucBondage, party on do what you do but if you continue spewing your blood all over people that are just going out to enjoy some good music its pretty likely the only shows you will be allowed in is your own. I know this is like talking to a brick wall considering there is already another thread about this but come on show some respect for the people putting on these shows that you seem to enjoy so much. Just wait until you are of age and try pulling that shit at a bar show. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 11:28am | ||
| Cooter User Info... | (like i dont like blood but why should he leave..if fucking diy is gonna come to play the show totally fucking drunk?) Very true.. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 3:31pm | ||
| rip skinny User Info... | i'd like to hear more about what we can do as individuals to "break away" from the establishment. i work at a gas station pumping gas, diesel and propane for dicks in giant S.U.V.'s. how would someone like me be able to support myself and survive, without being a bitch for some fatcat c.e.o. thousands of miles away. even at independant stores i would have a problem charging tax on products which goes straight to a goverment which isnt putting its money anywhere where i would want it to go. what are some alternatives? aight aight peace zak knott. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 3:43pm Edited: Sun, 3 Dec 2006 3:44pm | ||
| tyler User Info... | id like to have more like..workshops or whatever...i fucking love hearing about shit..like cordel im kinda like..stupid with stuff cause to be honest i dont really care but its pretty fucking sweet...id like to hear more in depth things to do with aGNARcho...ALL I GOT IS BLOOD FOR YOU - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 4:57pm | ||
| ScumFucBondage User Info... | " ScumFucBondage, party on do what you do but if you continue spewing your blood all over people that are just going out to enjoy some good music its pretty likely the only shows you will be allowed in is your own. I know this is like talking to a brick wall considering there is already another thread about this but come on show some respect for the people putting on these shows that you seem to enjoy so much. Just wait until you are of age and try pulling that shit at a bar show. " yeha bud i hear what your saying, I'm not trying to get it everywhere ahah, just when you slam it seems to jsut go all over the place... Most of the time I don't even try and bleed to be honest, I just always get like hit in the face haha, whatever its cool. - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 10:00pm | ||
| anarchoblitz User Info... | check out http://www.iskra.ws then the "links" section for more information on punk and anarchism. one can't wrap up anarchism in one sitting! it was just an introduction! - Sun, 3 Dec 2006 10:54pm Edited: Sun, 3 Dec 2006 10:57pm | ||
| jeff User Info... | "yeha bud i hear what your saying, I'm not trying to get it everywhere ahah, just when you slam it seems to jsut go all over the place... Most of the time I don't even try and bleed to be honest, I just always get like hit in the face haha, whatever its cool" cordell you wipped it on me(after i told you not to do it) andrew, and probably others too, and you were hitting your self. - Mon, 4 Dec 2006 1:38pm | ||
| Andrew User Info... | just let him do it, things have a way of working themselves out. either he'll be the next alice cooper (or gg alin, never got into that tho so i have no idea about the history), eating his own shit on stage making millions or some old drunk with a grey mowhawk. You have to admit there's something to be said for entertainment. i wouldn't be surprised if the infamy actualy helped mr scum fuck and his band. Id just say to pick your audience a bit better b4 u do it......lol - Mon, 4 Dec 2006 5:16pm Edited: Mon, 4 Dec 2006 5:16pm | ||
| eyecantsee User Info... | "i'd like to hear more about what we can do as individuals to "break away" from the establishment. i work at a gas station pumping gas, diesel and propane for dicks in giant S.U.V.'s. how would someone like me be able to support myself and survive, without being a bitch for some fatcat c.e.o. thousands of miles away. even at independant stores i would have a problem charging tax on products which goes straight to a goverment which isnt putting its money anywhere where i would want it to go. what are some alternatives?" ________________________________________________________ some good solutions I like to suggest is starting a workers collective ot small buisness so you don't have to work for some one else.... Not a buisness where you have employees though... Also check out the IWW that type of unionism is designed to give workers more power. Other solutions envolve freeing yourself ecconomically, by doing t6hings like living close to your work, dumpster diving, buying food from farmers marketts reusing shit as often as possible, living communally, and so on. All will reduce your cost of living so you have less expenses, thus you do not need to worj as much and have more free time... DIY also get some stickers for those SUVs, you can get bumper stickers that say stuff like "I love polution" or Global warming I don't care I;m in my SUV", or "ak me what I am doing to stop polution" - Mon, 4 Dec 2006 5:18pm | ||
| rip skinny User Info... | thanks a bunch, im gonna go look around to see what i can do and im gonna make sum stickers like that... - Mon, 4 Dec 2006 5:32pm | ||
| indole derivative User Info... | Did anyone leave a hoodie and sweater there? email me at [email protected] with a description and its yours. - Mon, 4 Dec 2006 7:02pm | ||
| XY-SATAN User Info... |  I kind of like that as a sticker ! : ) No really, right across a drawing of a dead bird/seal/marmot ! Very NOFX ! Hehe! .. and hey ..you're stealing Dead Jesus’s shtick ! - Mon, 4 Dec 2006 7:29pm | ||
| begbie User Info... | I'm curious about the whole anarchist thing. Are all anarchist low wage earners with little employable skill? NNB mentions bout the working class as one with no control or authority in their work place and can't afford stuff. I know workers who have no control but are making shit loads of $$$ in the trades, computer industries and as white collar workers and they are not complaining about their jobs because they have employable skills (ie. wielders can get a job anywhere and can commamd high wages). Don't anarchists have any ambition to get away from poverty and actually improve their economic situation? If they don't like their economic situation, why don't they try to improve it by getting an education or become an entrepeneur. Anarchists can talk shit about Bill Gates but he has done more to help people around the world than any of the protestors who smash windows and throw bricks. - Tue, 5 Dec 2006 7:29pm | ||
| NOISE NOT BOMBS User Info... | I'm curious about the whole anarchist thing. Are all anarchist low wage earners with little employable skill? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ No most are trades people such as members of the IWW often tend to be welders, mechanics, loggers even, many even work in the oilfield. Groups such as NEFAC have memberships in the tens of thousands, and almost all of their embers are trades workers. Also many anarchists have always gone to the academic rout, such as Allan Antliff, the professor of art history at UVIC, who has published 2 books on anarchism. Allan Oconor is anouther example, as is Professor Ward Churchill, or Noam Chomsky. Anarchists are a diverse crowd coming from all different backgrounds, with all different degrees of education, skills and so on. Wolf for example who gave the presentation has a masters degree in music. He is a composer. How about you? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Don't anarchists have any ambition to get away from poverty and actually improve their economic situation? If they don't like their economic situation, why don't they try to improve it by getting an education or become an entrepeneur. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Many stores and all kinds of buisnesses have been and are run by anarchusts, and a large ammount of anarchists are self employed. Dark Horse books for example is run by an anarchist. As are many workers collectives. Grassroots cafe, in peterbrough is a good example of a collective that ran for many years. Most anarchists tend to work a job as well because tey feel it is wrong to make money off anarchism, so they are often part of a collective, as well as doing other actavism, and still working too. Unlike the capitalists, anarchists care more about their ethics than money. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Anarchists can talk shit about Bill Gates but he has done more to help people around the world than any of the protestors who smash windows and throw bricks. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Bill gates gives a tiny portion compared to what he could, and still has more than any one needs, as well he has constantly run buisnesses out, destroyed his competition, all to get more, you talked about entapenureship, well bill gates has done much to stop that. It is debateable if the money he gives to charity dose more good than the damage he has done, also all the charities he gives money to are ones that pay high fees to executives, and such out of money collected. Grassroots groups are less corrupt, as well as being able to achieve real change in thier communities. Every sunday for example I cook with food not bombs, an international collective with over 200 groups arround the world. We serve free food to people that could not afford to eat healthy, and no one else dose. - Wed, 6 Dec 2006 1:37am | ||
| NOISE NOT BOMBS User Info... | oh yeah, and I agree about holding signs being a waste of time, those are tatics commonly employed by liberals, that only serve to strenghten the system, where it is allowed to have an oppinion as long as you do it this way and buy a permit first. As for throwing bricks, what happened in seatle brought ot light some huge issues arround globalization, and forced the media to report on the anti globalization movement that was going on, causing much greater interest in it. It brought about a new awareness for many on issues arround groups like the WTO, as well as things like exploitation on coffee farmers, coffee being the most traded comodity in the world, most of which is under payed labor, and sold through companies like starbuck. The fire bombing of the red hot videos in the 0s by the wimmins fire brigade succeeded in stopping rape films from being sold in that community, when all other methods had failed. More commonly anarchists use techniques of collectivisation, doing things like living together to cut ecconomic barriers, or rganizing community gardens, free stores, and many community projects. Please take the time to check out groups like the back raven book vollective, a non profit anarchist group in your community. It seams that if you have time to try and mock people over the internet for having beliefs, you must have enough time to read some good anarchist litterature, made available in your community by collectivization, and by anarchists being entrepenures, and running their own bussnesses. Or if you do not have enough money for books, you can always read more online at wikipedia.org, or flagblackened.net or infoshop.org before you critique anarchism saying it can't work, you may wanna stuffy what you claim to think dosn't work, cause otherwise we just dismiss you for your lack of knowledge on the subject. - Wed, 6 Dec 2006 1:49am | ||
| begbie User Info... | I admit that I don't know much about anarchism but I do know about Antliff because I have taken courses with him. However, you don't know much about Bill Gates philanthropy. He is the largest donator ever and he has said that he will only leave a miniscule percentage of his wealth to his family. He has donated billions and one example is the 250 mil he pledged to fight malaria. The money is going to physicans, geneticists, entymologists, pathologists, researchers, etc. Grassroot groups are not going to solve the problem of malaria because to attract highly skilled individuals you have to spend some money - they are not going to work for free ( Does Chomsky or Antliff teach for free?) GAte's foundation is so effective that Alan Greenspan donated a lot of his wealth to Gate's foundation and not to other NGOs (Oxfam, etc). The reason Microsoft is so large is because there is no other choice. I don't like Windows and Linux is for computer geeks, not for general users,and Apple OS will only work on their over-priced computers. He became wealthy because of default. If you want change why not do it from the top. Want to change a law - become a MP and introduce a bill. Want to change a corporation - become the majority shareholder. You seem to think that violence is the only way to change things (firebombing and rock throwing) so if some KKKs want their area free from minorities perhaps it's ok for them to firebomb synagoges and black churches. Vegans who don't want people to eat meat, they could either inject it with rat poison or firebomb resturants and supermarkets. You may not like the "liberals" for holding signs but at least it's not environmentally destructive. Idiot rock throwers destroy and all of the destruction gets hauled off to the landfill. More raw material is needed to rebuild everything that was destroyed. To pay for the damages, the store owner has to either raise prices or lay off staff because building material and labour doesn't come for free. - Wed, 6 Dec 2006 10:08am | ||
| mike. User Info... | well atleast the bands were good... - Thu, 7 Dec 2006 10:30am | ||
| Noise Not Bombs User Info... | No labor is exploited, not free. If you knew any thing about me you would know I am a pasafist. When Direct Action (wimmins fire brigade) used fire bombs, they went out of their way to try and ensure that no one was hurt, they were a pasafist group. In this particular example I agree with the use of a molotov, usually I wouldn't. What I support more is large scale organized strikes by base unions, not burracratic unions. I support non violent direct action, collectivisations and community building. I also agree with wolf edwards, that you or I have no right to fucking say how some one else should choose to defend themselves. Thje insurgents in Nazi Germany is his fabv example, they rose up and killed the nazi guards, using violence, and freed themselves, are you to say that is wrong. Doing nothing is violence, waving a sign is almost doing nothing, esspecailly if that and voting is the extent of you action. And no I won't support a corrupt system, the on;ly way you rise to power is if you are kissing the right ass. I say fuck that, I don't want power over any one, except myself. community organizing, self empoewrment. thats the way to a future that is not oppressed. - Thu, 7 Dec 2006 5:54pm | ||
| begbie User Info... | "hje insurgents in Nazi Germany is his fabv example, they rose up and killed the nazi guards, using violence, and freed themselves, are you to say that is wrong." With that analogy are you saying that guns are held to your head right now and you are the next person to step into the shower. Are you comparing the plight of your group to the Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto? The IRA had usually phone in the attacks so that no one would get hurt. Do you support their tactics? If Tim McVeigh had phone in and they had evacuated the Murrah building before the explosion, would that be ok? To his eyes, what he did was right much like to your eyes, what the Direct Action did was right. Have you heard of Chuck Cadman. His kid was killed so he took action by getting elected and introduced a bill which was incorporated into the Youth Justice Act. He did not toss a single brick into any window to change the system. If he had to kiss ass I still have more respect for him then anyone who destroys property as a sign of protest.. - Fri, 8 Dec 2006 9:34pm | ||
| xXxComradexXx User Info... | what ever waste your time with corrupt poloticians if you want. sorry but I got better shit to do, the gov has stopped bills to help the homeless and cutfunding to programs, refuses to stop seal hunts, or to stop sick animal testing, and presses for many laws that help the rich and almost none that help the few. I aint got time to waste with bullshit burrocracy, people are starving/dying/freezing today, animals are being torchered, ands no ammount of politics and sign waving will stop it cause it is not important or profitable to allow it to continue... I do support the ALF, I do support the antiglobalization bill, cause all the gov has ever done is made it easier to exploit these people, and animals, so fuck that. not doing anything to stop them from killing and torchering is violence. - Sat, 9 Dec 2006 3:36am | ||
| Andrew User Info... | the sad thing is that in any organization you have to kiss a bit of ass (be nice to people that you dont like) to get anywhere. There is a line though of speaking to some1 with respect/ass kissing. - Sat, 9 Dec 2006 1:30pm | ||
| rip skinny User Info... | don't step on my blue suede shoes. - Mon, 11 Dec 2006 7:25pm | ||
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