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Marriage
| Message Board > General Chitchat > Marriage |
| Anonymous | What are your opinions? Do you aspire to be married or not? - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:27am | ||
| Anonymous | Don't do it. It's highly overated. Unless of course you don't want a sex life. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:29am | ||
| Anonymous | if she's hot, and likes to fuck all the time, is funny and has her own shit goin' on, should be fun. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:43am | ||
| Anonymous | in the words of K.C. - "married, buried..." - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 1:34am | ||
| Isobellia User Info... | I was engaged once and Im only 21 actually its been seven months and still recuperating and i never wanted to get married and then before i knew it the appreciation for it grew and it was too late so now all i want is that one person to spend and grow with for the rest of my life which would be so beautifull Please excuse my atrocious spelling - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:16am | ||
| crow | I was married once she was young.I told her we should wait till she experienced life a little more.She said no...i love you blah blah.So we got hitched had kids and sure as shit it didn't work.So i said never again but...met a girl with kids here we are 10 yrs later going strong. 1 word of advice make damn sure you are 100% compatible by living together for a while the longer the better make sure things don't change too drastically after shacking up and go from there. GOOD LUCK!!!! - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:24am | ||
| Ty Stranglehold User Info... | I've been married for three years and it's great. My wife and I have a great relationship in most aspects and I would consider myself very happy. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:36am | ||
| KnifeGhost User Info... | I aspire to be married.... But I'm only 21, so fuck it... I'm not in a hurry... - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:38am | ||
| Anonymous | Don't do it! Waste of time and money! Marriage is like Valintines day, it's just a medium for people to make money! Even if you do it on the cheap, it's cheaper to get married than it is to get divorced! If two people love one another, there is no need for a piece of paper. You'll be happier in the end if it doesn't work out! If after you have had kids and lived together for a few years and know that it's going to work, fine. Go for it! But it's a much over rated existance! - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 10:10am | ||
| some girl... | I do, but I don't know about kids. I support the symbolic nature of it and men seem more masculine when they wear a ring (I guess I think that b/c it seems to me that they got their shit together?). But... I also have parents who have never in their 36 years of marriage fought in front of me... so I'm kinda living in a romantic fantasy world-->which my boyfriend reminds me isn't a reality! - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 10:11am | ||
| Attached | In my opinion, marriage is an institution that has lived beyond it's due course. Look at divorce rates and tell me that I'm wrong. You don't need to spend a fortune and look good in the eyes of God (or your family) to pronounce your committment to one another. I'm all for a ceremony or a party in honor of common love and experience, but "marriage" carries too much weight, is based upon societal ethics that have long since changed and has too many life altering (legal) implications. Union, is good. Binding, is bad. It amazes me how many people still believe that the "Leave it to Beaver" experience is actually possible. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 11:11am | ||
| Anonymous | i think marriage is a good thing. ONLY if both parties have what it takes to actually make that type of commitment to each other. why are the divorce rates so high? it's because nobody takes marriage seriously anymore. as well as the commitment, there needs to be give and take, forgiveness, self sacrifice...etc. i think it should be a "once-in-a-lifetime" thing with someone who you have already been with for quite some time. (i'm talking 5+ years) unfortunately, there are far too many people that give marriage a bad name then people that make it work, which in turn scares people away from it. i also beleive nobody should be tying the knot until you're at least 30. by then you have a good head on your shoulders (well, some of us anyways) and should be emotionally mature enough to take it seriously and handle the difficult times. and there will be difficult times. the problem is that we live in such a disposable society, that as soon as things get rocky, instead making it work - some will throw everything away. you want to be 50 and alone? i don't think so. think of the big picture. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 11:16am | ||
| ticklefish | Marriage = Leaave it to Beaver? You are the one living in a fantasy world. There are so many other ways to live a marriage. It totally depends where you are in your life. I never thought I would get married, but here I am now, married and happier than i have ever been. My wife and I continue to be amazed at how strong our bond is, how much stronger it is every day, and although I know I could live (heart beat, brain waves, kidney fuction) without her, now that I live with her, I don't ever want to live without her. Until you experience the feeling of going to sleep at night looking into that person's eyes that light up your life, and seeing them there in the morning, knowing that through all the shit and all the heaven they are still there... if this image makes your stomach churn, then clearly, you aren't ready for it. Too bad. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 11:19am | ||
| Anonymous | Yea...wait 10 more years and then tell us all about it! If you still feel the same way then great! True love! - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:10pm | ||
| ticklefish | its called faith man, if you approach marriage from the mindset that in 10 years it is going to suck, well then, I guarantee you it is going to suck. Sure, check in in 10 yrs. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 12:59pm | ||
| Anonymous | Actually, the point was that people change, life changes and that in ten years you may not be as comfortable as you are right now! You may not have the same goals. I really do hope that you are still happy and don't mean to be negative, just realistic... I hope that it always works for you guys! You'd be part of a very small minority! - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 1:45pm | ||
| mark mor User Info... | Fuck marriage. If there is one way to screw up one's life it is to tie the proverbial knot. you might as well just admit defeat and roll over and die. And then if you don't propose when you are under pressure from your GF, you're labelled a commitment phobe. What a bunch of bullshit. "YOU'RE FIRED!!!" is my response to that. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 1:48pm | ||
| S.V. | No relationship is guaranteed...married or not. Some people just like the ritual and public committment of "marriage". Personally, I've been with the same fella for 13+ years without being married, and it hasn't been an issue thus far (though we are technically engaged). However there is something to be said for receiving a vast amount of wedding presents ;) ;) ;) - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 1:54pm | ||
| some girl... | Tickelfish--> I couldn't agree more with you. "True Love" only exists when you've been through hell and back with a person over and over and over again and you find your love has actually matured. Key word: matured. When I see my parents and how they're such a mushy romantic couple I have to remind myself that they've stuck with eachother after a bankruptcy, 4 kids, illness, car accidents, 3 big career failures, deaths etc etc. The love I see now does not represent their love 36 years ago. Who would ever want to have the same love for a person 10 years from now? I find the people who expect nothing to change once married are the ones fucking up. Basically, it's not marriage thats at fault, it's people's expectations and irrationalities (is that a word?). - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:22pm | ||
| Nic | Mark Mor, you try to come off as such a prick....I know you're really just a sweet heart and I know you'd be a super husband. As for the whole marriage thing, you should have to be at least 30 before your allowed to do it. - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:28pm | ||
| some girl... | My mom tells me that in 'her day' couples had to do a course to see if they'd be ready. Mind you, she's Catholic, but that doesn't sound so bad: like a driver's test but instead you learn accounting, relationship communication/problem handling skills, household crap... oh wait! Did we not learn ANY of that in school? (lol). p.s. what DID we learn from our elementry/high school years anyways??? - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:35pm | ||
| Anonymous | In lu of gifts is a great one! Money, lottsa money ;-0 :-) - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 2:36pm | ||
| Anonymous | FYI Even today, if you're gettin hitched by a preacher, they will want to interview you a few times to make sure that you understand what you are getting into. My ex and I had several meetings with our rev and he was very helpful. Made us think... Still, to me, it's a huge waste of money for a 10 or 20 thousand dollar party... If the two people are sure and it works then great, most of the time, a waste... - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 3:29pm | ||
| Anonymous | How is it that on this board getting married is such a no-no to some people, but it seems that having kids isn't? That's a bit more of a committment than marriage is. It should be anyway - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 6:18pm | ||
| Anonymous | Been with my "wife" now for almost four years. We have never been ofically married because I have a bad feeling when I think of the state or a religious institution giving my relationship some kind of "official recognition". Is it any less real that we are commetted to each other without the paper? I don't believe so, I love my son and will always be his Dad, no paper will change that..I don't see the point myself but hey to each his/her own. Kola - Tue, 17 Jun 2003 6:30pm | ||
| KnifeGhost User Info... | "Still, to me, it's a huge waste of money for a 10 or 20 thousand dollar party..." Anyone who spends that much money on a wedding is insane... Weddings, to me, should be fun and laid back, the dude and the chick (or the dude and the dude or the chick and the chick) say their shit, sign the papers, then everybody kicks back...... I'm with Ticklefish on this one.... - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 2:10am | ||
| ticklefish | OUr wedding wasn't cheap, but it wasn't the $20K variety either....we made it as efficient as we could. I have been to many weddings that had half the guests we did that cost twice as much for a 5 hour start-finish affair. we did 150 people on a farm in teh okanagan with a killer DJ, a whole long weekend of camping and partying, a whole roast lamb on a spit, a $1/drink bar (anything you wanted and we had it all), not a church in sight, no preachers, live music one night, and a good jam while the DJ took a break. Pancake breakfasts, games for kids and big kids.... Best weekend of my life because I got to stand in front of 150 of my best friends and relatives to say "see this woman here? I am going to marry her, and we are going to stick it out through whatever life throws at us....now come on, get down and let's have a party that lasts three days". These friends and relatives would never have met each other if it weren't for the wedding, people from all over Canada and the US. I guarantee you, you will never have a party like that (not our party, but the one you will have at YOUR wedding) To those who object to marriage based on "insitution" or "religion".... for fucks sake, you've got no damn imagination, no romance.... - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 12:29pm | ||
| Anonymous | Romance and the estate of marriage have little to do with one another! - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 12:38pm | ||
| Wreaker of Havoc User Info... | Got married, had kidlets, didnt work.....imagine that. Im such a catch too! - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 12:41pm | ||
| ticklefish | I didn't mean to imply that if you weren't married you had no romance.... and now I re-read what I said it does sound that way. All I meant was that a "wedding" doesn't have to have anything to do with "institutionalization"....for us, the whole point of the wedding was to get all our friends and relatives together for one big-ass party. There is no way we would have got all those people together if we just said "come to a party"... the entire point was that it is as personal or as institutional as you make it. The point of a marriage to us wasn't for a piece of paper and formal legal recognition, the point was to have a massive celebration of the journey we intend to embark upon, and we really wanted to have as many of our friends and relatives from far off places come together for the event. I will stick by the "unimaginative" comment though.... you just have to be creative. You can get married by any certified wedding commisioner, be they a ship's captain or a judge or a family friend who has had themselves certified, it doesn't have to have anything to do with a church. - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 1:45pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | I agree again with you ticklfish: marriage should (I think) be a social/public thing. I'm not married but the way I see it: this is the day that a couple gets to feel totally "special" --which is different from all other "halmark" occassions. As I've made it previously known, I absolutly LOVE Christmas, but it is not even the slightest bit as great as going to a wedding (all 3 of my siblings are married). But again, to each their own. My boyfriend isn't into marriage at all (damnit). - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 2:54pm | ||
| Anonymous | Hey Ticklefish... your wife is a very lucky woman! Hope she prints out your comments and saves them! They are worth more than any other piece of paper that says you are married! Congratulations and best wishes to you both on a successful and loving relationship... and being proud of it! - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 8:17pm | ||
| Anonymous | Yeah, ticklefish, I'm not kidding when I say I teared up when I read your thing about your wedding. thats so fucking cool. - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 8:28pm | ||
| my secret past | Hmmm, wonder why I teared... I believe people should ideally wait til they're older before embarking on marriage, or a committed relationship for that matter. I also believe that people's family experiences should be taken into account. And that the ceremony be taken seriously. I say these things because my story sucks. My parents were in their 40's when they had me, and there was never any question of splitting. His parents split when he was 5, mom was a headcase, agoriphobic, hypochondriac, never went on with her life. His dad went on to 2 other wives. Me and him met real young (17 and 21), best friends for a year then fell in love..la dee da. I supported him and his music career. Engagement ring. Bogus "ceremony" on vacation in a different country, no papers, thought it was private and not necessary. No vows, nothing to sweat about, think about heavily or say in front of witnesses. 5 years in, we decided his career would work out better in the states, no sense 2 illegals, so I stayed here working "til he got stuff happening". 4 years, $300 phone bills, visits every 2-3 months, eventually heavy depression, he finally cheated, a year and a half breakup (while family members got sick and lay dying - its like a dominoe effect). Lost my best friend. Haven't spoken since then. When he cheated I was devasted, like the earth gave way underneath me, I didn't think it was possible, the bond was so strong, and I'd never experienced anyone's breakup. To him it wasn't so odd because he'd seen it happen so much, but seeing me lose it like that he felt like crap and will forever. We were kids, we didn't know. 7 years later I've come so far (lost 6 friends to cancer/suicides immediately after, then my parents), I'm a way different person, way stronger, and a way too independent too. Relationships are serious shit. I avoid them now and just see a lot of shows! wierd writing all this stuff, its not something ya talk about y'know? - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 8:56pm | ||
| Anonymous | More power to ya girl! A sad story and I bet there's allot of them like that out there. Unless you have been together for many years and are 100% sure that you will die together, marriage sucks! Waste of money for a huge party. Except when it really means something. - Wed, 18 Jun 2003 9:39pm | ||
| ticklefish | shit, this can't be Livevictoria can it? People actually talking about feelings and good stuff? thanks for the good wishes .... just to add to the cake, we are expecting a baby any day now...due date is officially 48 hrs away....heck it could be starting right now....gotta go - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 1:26am | ||
| Ty Stranglehold User Info... | My parents split when I was 17 and managed to realize that they truly do love each other, so they reconciled 5 years later. They're still happy to this day. aaaaaawwwwwww! - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 2:06am | ||
| Anonymous | This is a warm and fuzzy thread. - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 2:23pm | ||
| been there | The point must not be lost in the ceremony. Mean what you say. Everything in life is about walk more than talk. I hope she finds happiness. - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 2:56pm | ||
| Anonymous | why did you assume it was a girl that told that story? keep those minds a little more open - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 2:57pm | ||
| Anonymous | what story? - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 2:59pm | ||
| For Ticklefish | Hello again Ticklefish! WOW... it doesn't stop does it! You think you're happy now... just wait till your little one arrives! By the way... MY birthday is June 20th!!! Geminis with a Cancer cusp are TRULY WONDERFUL PEOPLE!!! Creative... musical... artistic... innovative (if I do say so myself!) Let us know when the baby arrives. - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 3:03pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | - why did you assume it was a girl that told that story? Because she said that "he cheated..." Lets not get all political/radical feminist/gayist/whatever you're trying to do, kay? This is a really sweet post, lets keep the sweetness going! (may be she is a he: I doubt anyone cares). - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 3:03pm | ||
| Anonymous | i think this post is great too just figured, if it was a guy who wrote that, "you go girl" could be a tad presumptuous. - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 3:09pm | ||
| ticklefish | I figure because of all the good vibes in this thread the usual "fuck you" people can't even get past the first 6 or 7 posts to bring this thread to the usual LiveVic levels of a slagfest.. no little one yet, but I will surely post when it happens And I totally agree with the comment about "walking the walk".... if you get married, think long and hard about the vows you make, they aren't just pretty words to say to an audience, they are the words you have to back up each and every day. I think that is the biggest "problem" with marriage today, lots of people still say "in sickness and in health ....etc", but in the back of their minds they are also thinking "well, that depends ....". If you have conditions under which you would walk away, then chances are likely that you will find excuses to walk away (like horoscopes, you read into them what you want to believe). Of course, if I found out my wife was a serial killer, that would change my mind, but you kind of need to get to know the person before you walk into marriage. You only get as good as you give, if you are willing to forgive, to stick through the hard times, the arguments, the compromises, then your partner will be more likely to do the same for you. In the words of a mentor I had a few years back "If I had known 40 years ago how hard my marriage would be, how much pain and frustration we would have to endure, I wouldn't have done it, but now that I have done it and lived 40 years with my wife, I can't imagine how empty my life would have been without her. I am a better, stronger, more forgiving and compasssionate person because of those battles, and a united team of two can always go farther than a team of one". - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 3:14pm | ||
| Anonymous | this could be seen as educational! - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 4:08pm | ||
| my secret past | Hi again, I'm female. I agree with T'fish. If we'd taken the time to seriously consider marriage vows, and voice them to the world, we might have taken it slower, not made assumptions. He was the best friend I've ever had, when we first made that transition into bfriend/gfriend we were scared to death that it wouldn't work out and we'd lose the friendship too, but we fell for each other hard. But when you're that young, you don't know yourself yet. At least we didn't. We didn't know how having it so good together (and not "needing" anything much else), limited our personal growth outside of the relationship, and thats unhealthy for two freedom-loving people. You really have no idea what new things you'll learn about yourself, or if they'll meld right with the other's. I'm a very different person now, way more outgoing, outspoken, entertaining around others, way more extroverted - like him. I realized that I could be a lot of the things I loved about him, on my own. It took a complete loss of him to realize that I didn't need him to complete my whole person. Another thing I learned out of it is about the whole psychology of relationships... thats a lot to get into, wanting to be babied, fathered, whatever, then not wanting to play that anymore, which forces the next stage of the relationship where you drop that shit and behave as adults - not everyone makes it through that hoop and thats really unfortunate, because it certainly doesn't mean that you're not compatible, it just means that those projections are exhausted, you may not be as attracted to each other for a while, and you need to view each other differently to respark it. We're all pretty complex ever-growing creatures needing new stimulation. I wanted to see it through, he wanted "other" - a phrase that triggers a ice cold jolt through my heart to this day. I at least wanted the friendship to remain, but we were both in so much pain by that point, we couldn't do it. I've been over the depression for 2 years now. It took that long because the loss after loss (first deaths I'd ever had in my life) didn't give me a chance to catch my breath. And I stopped telling people stuff going on because it was too harsh to share and a couple close friends had walked away cuz of it (its too painful to see your friends go through serious shit for so long). I finally didn't even tell people my mom died. Thats not healthy, but you get tired of bumming everyone else out too. I'm happy now but very independent, lots of guys ask me out, but I very rarely take anyone up on it, maybe I don't trust, I just see shows, and try to do what I love. From the depths of hell comes huge amounts of light, so I'm v e r y lucky to love music the way I do anyway. Lots of people don't have that. wow this is all about me me me... sorry 'bout that. Thanks Ticklefish, your take on things is just so cool, "words you have to back up each and every day" and that warning about having conditions under which you'd walk away. Its a lot to have to consider, and when you're lost in that first love thing, when its way more comfortable to put up blinders and enjoy the bliss. - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 4:34pm | ||
| ticklefish | talking of bliss...it never lasts. But you find a new bliss. - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 4:49pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | Hey "my secret past", I hope you realize the strong/helpful affect (effect?)that you're having on the board! The fact that you can be so honest is awesome, especially about basically "needing" someone else to complete you, and then finding out that that's just a bunch of crap. I know I've gone out with guys hoping that they'd "complete" me (usually opposites attract: I'm loud/extrovert, so I'd go out w/ introverts and then get all irrate when they'd tell me to settle down). Glad to hear that you've learned so much/bettering your life! - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 5:47pm | ||
| SweetGrass | Wow! I've been ignoring this post cause I figured it was bashing happiness but what a wicked surprise I've had reading this. Cudos to everyone for saying it straight and opening up. I don't believe in marriage as an institution as the Gov't needs to give it a stamp of approval. I do believe in partnership and love and commitment and any way you can share your life. Troutbreath and myself have been partners for over 10 years and we are still having a great time! Doing all the things you are not supposed to do like running a business together and playing in a band together. We are better friends today than we were 10 years ago! - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 6:01pm | ||
| Anonymous | does anybody have a tissue? - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 7:09pm | ||
| Anonymous | Bwaaahhhhhhh hhuunngggg bwaaaaahhhhhhhhhh! - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 7:15pm | ||
| Anonymous | I love these people that live totally in the now! After 15 or 20 years humpin the same rump, listening to the same snoring, same whines, same arguements, same jobs, same, house, same, same, same... Talk to us then! If you are still together and happy, more power to ya... I was in love, thought that it would never end... Yea right... We were both madly in love... After 6 years, other people, CHANGE!! I think that its pretty natural! - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 7:16pm | ||
| Anonymous | This is enough to end any marriage http://www.angelfire.com/scary/nakedjohn/index.html - Thu, 19 Jun 2003 10:10pm | ||
| Left for Dead | The vultures had to swoop in sometime. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 5:47am | ||
| Anonymous | i'm surprised it took them this long to swoop. It's easier to bash to than admit you are not mature or emotionally capable of maintaining your end of a relationship. There are lots of people who are extremely happy after 15 years The amount that you've given, received, shared and learned about yourself and your partner is something you wouldn't trade for the world. When I'd been together with my girlfriend for a year (after being friends for 2 years), I would tell people she was the one, ya know, sometimes you just know. They would tell me the same sort of thing I'm reading here, just wait five years. Well, my girlfirend is now my wife, we have a daughter, and we've been together for 7 years, 9 if you count the friendship. She's still the love of my life. I can still catch myself staring at her in amazement. She still excites me as much as ever. And the real love keeps growing, the kind that you only get to have when you put yourself on the emotional line enough to really know someone. Tell me whatever you want. I say maybe the problem is you. I say maybe you're not emotionally capable of providing the sort of nurturing a long term relationship requires. I say talk to me again in another 10 years. I promise you I'll be saying the same thing. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 10:56am | ||
| Anonymous | Blah blah blah... That's what they all say UNTIL??? So many things can change/interupt a relationship... Never is a long time there poster. Words do mean something you know! Be as positive as you like, nothing wrong with that, but don't preach your crap to the rest of us... Life is full of changes and perhaps you haven't hit the ones that will effect your relationship yet, huh? Illness, other people, boring sex, money and the list goes on and on... When your down and your partner has had enough...what then??? - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 11:15am | ||
| Anonymous | ----"Words do mean something you know!" Exactly: listen to your own words: back-up statements like "in sickness & health... BETTER OR WORSE!!!" Yeesh! Read Ticklefish's statement: it sums it all up. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 11:35am | ||
| my secret past | But you can't say that they're ain't beauty in that determination that their's will stand the test. He's not preaching, he's saying, and he's inspiring some, even if it ain't you. All those people with half-assed views on everything in life lose out - me, I got carried away, and every second was worth it. Til the end, listening to Heroes over and over and mourning the death of that very feeling. And hey thanks for saying that Some Girl! I figure when you suffer or see someone you love suffer, you've got to examine it, learn from it, cuz it'd be a crime for all that pain to be wasted on simply feeding darkness. Figure out how to gain light from it, if not immediately, later on when you're able. I lost some great people, but I have good stories about them, which hopefully can inspire in its good points and in its bad ones help others to see what kind of turns life is capable of throwing you so they can prepare. "Knowledge is power"? Thing is that if you only see it as dark and ugly, that sucks. That why I never get a chance to talk about it, cuz the way it sounds (the facts) people see it as all bad. Its kinda fascinating, to look back on the trip, however intense it gets - once you come out of it! And re Ticklefish, are we all in agreement that thats one lucky kid or what! - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 11:37am | ||
| some girl... User Info... | Hey there My Secret Past: I think you register your alias as Dr Ruth or something, and then kick our asses with good advice when the board gets out of hand! (ha ha haaa). You sound like the type that might get a kick out out http://www.disgruntledhousewife.com (especially the "hey girls, look at me, I'm a dick" list or "send me your hate mail"). Check it out and tell me what you think-? - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 12:01pm | ||
| my secret past | oooh - oooH, OOOOOOH, all that swellin's hurtin ma head! I think its cool everyone takes turns on here with advice, I just have problems being concise, so its makin it sound like a (more annoying) and bigger deal. I like the one phrase words of wisdom the best, usually when they come from anons (but not always). They can't change the anon thing on here, WE'D MISS OUT ON THAT! Yeah, that site was kinda funny, I'm a little more abrasive humor-wise than that though! Funny, I've got a DHW dishcloth around that I got in a music conference goody-bag down south once a long time ago. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 2:25pm | ||
| Anonymous | None of this is advice. Its more like people honestly telling about there experiences. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 2:52pm | ||
| ticklefish | I just love people who are so cynical that they believe everyone must share the same sense of cynicism. To the naysayers who seem to have nothing better to contribute than " just wait 10 years and something will change"....no shit something will change, that is the whole point, and that is the mindset you have to enter a marriage (or other commitment, if people choose common-law, that is awesome too). Change will happen, and strong partnerships weather that change, relationships change every day, every week, every year. My wife and I are best friends, lovers, spiritual partners, both leaders and followers. We (the happily married ones) aren't preaching marriage, the original post was " are you for or against marriage". I am for marriage, because I am in one that works, and I am happier in it than I ever was out of it, and this isn't infatuation or bliss, this is love. And love gets ugly sometimes, but it is the only thing that keeps you going. troll away, and be as negative as you like, and you will not have a successful long term relationship so long as you think that "I am in this until....x", or "she will change and that will be the end". Shit if you think that the change will be the end, I guarantee it will be the end, but if you say, "she is going to change, and I am going to love to get to know that new person". If you believe that there is a future, or that there is no future, you are right. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 3:16pm | ||
| Anonymous | Nice thoughts but change is sometimes not something that people have in common! There are so many kinds of change. Not saying to expect it to ruin your relationship, just saying to be realistic and know that this is a strong possibility. Just admitt that this could and can happen. Maybe not to you or others but it's usually the cause for most breakups. Even the ones that are still in love have to deal with and sometimes end up walking away still in love. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 4:01pm | ||
| my secret past | Its interesting that my take was representing the death of a relationship, while Ticklefish is representing the life of a thriving one. I'm with ya TF (I really love how you phrase things), and your view was my take on things, but taking it when someone cheats on you right when you're already down as low as you thought you could go and then after the devastation wants to continue seeing other people too... I don't know, kudos to anyone who can dust themselves off and continue on after that one. But you're right, some people can and do. (sorry to continue being so melodramatic, but its simply accurate). Please don't take it like I'm trying to rain on anything you've said, thats definately not my intent. But it can be a realy tough go for people sometimes. Not everyone is as respectful to one another as we'd hope and sometimes they are and then change quite surprisingly with warnings. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 4:08pm | ||
| my secret past | sorry, with NO warning. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 4:10pm | ||
| Anonymous | Well said my secret life. That's all I was trying to say. Sounds like ticklefish and his significant other have it great and I hope that it continues to be that way for them. A succesful relationship always gives hope to others and sets a great example! I was just pointing out that more often then not, your kind of situation happens. Someone changes without notice. Could be the people they hang out with. Could be many things, but more often than not, it happens. I wouldn't want to see ticklefish be playing in a bar and meet some devestatingly attractive person that they are attracted to. This could seriously rain on that parade. Then the thoughts follow, should I be single, would I like to be with other people sexually? The beginning of the end unfortunately! - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 4:13pm | ||
| Anonymous | PS I salute ticklefish & his partner and have nothing but good hopes for them. Just being realistic. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 4:17pm | ||
| Anonymous | PSPS Oh yea! And the "lets see other people at the sametime" line is hylarious! People like that always get it in the end though! - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 4:18pm | ||
| ticklefish | too many anons posting, so I don't know who i am talking with! My Secret Life, my comments were not directed at you. If I had been married in my 20's there is no doubt it would have ended in disaster. Nor am I arguing with the person who is saying "you never know what change will do to you", because I know that to be true too. And I know you can "split" with someone and still love them, sometimes that is why you split. My argument has been mostly to a few anon posters who have just tried to throw gasoline on the fire, who seem to believe that all relationships end in failure, and who seem to be trying to pop the balloon of a few people who have posted here who say they are happy and are in it for the long haul. To the balloon poppers.... make sure you wear a condom and don't let that one pop! and as an update....no baby yet.... due day is officially today, but only 4% of babies actually arrive on the due date.... any day now. - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 5:02pm | ||
| Anonymous | Congrats and I hope that it all goes well! Best wishes! When that baby pops out, get ready!! Life's gonna get interesting LOL! PS It was me that was always being realistic. Happy birthday (When it happens) to your wonderful new addition! Cheers! - Fri, 20 Jun 2003 5:22pm | ||
| Anonymous | this was some very non-livevic reading! - Sat, 21 Jun 2003 11:53am | ||
| ticklefish | .....and the labour is underway.... new arrival coming any hour now.... - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:32am | ||
| crow | congrats Good Luck. - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:35am | ||
| SweetGrass | Many good thoughts for you and yours...King Bong loves babies and have a few little bongsters amongst our members. - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 1:55am | ||
| my secret past | Hey Ticklefish, hope all's going (or went) well! A beautiful day for a baby! - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 12:20pm | ||
| Hey there Big Daddy! | Daddy Ticklefish!!!! How was the most beautiful moment in your life? How's your lovely wife and that brand new member of the Vic music scene doing? Enquiring minds want to know!!! All the very best to you and YOUR FAMILY! Life just gets better all the time, doesn't it? - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 2:09pm | ||
| Ticklefish | Boy! Quinn Christopher Ness Stockdale, 10lbs, 21.5" long, born at 5:38 am.... thank you all for the kind words, and this is the most amazing day of my life. I never knew how complete something like this can make you feel. I am still giddy - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 3:27pm | ||
| Shaggy User Info... | Grats Ticklefish! - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 5:16pm | ||
| The Ref | Congrats tickle!!! All the best to you and the family! Woochie cooochie coooo to little Christopher!!! - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 5:18pm | ||
| KnifeGhost User Info... | Wow, that's a big kid.... Congratulations.... This has to be the first birth on LiveVictoria..... - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 5:23pm | ||
| SweetGrass | How's Mom doing, yikes that's a big kid. Many congatulations for your family. I can't believe the love on this post... Maybe the "birth" of a new attitude on the board. ( But I doubt it ) Cheers,SweetGrass - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 5:28pm | ||
| ticklefish | I wish this was the birth of a new board. Why on earth can't we have a board about the scene where people pat each other on the back and talk about the shit that means something in their lives instead of the piss poor bullshit ? I really really wish this board would go the way of having manditory logons to weed out the anon dicks (not all anons are dicks, but it is easier to be a dick when you are anonymous) And, mom is doing great. Holy shit, to expand upon the whole "marriage" thread and what it means to dedicate yourself to someone else, once you see a woman, especially the woman you love, go through a birth, and see the strength and power they contain, and to see them give birth to your child. The world will never be the same. - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 10:25pm | ||
| S.V. | Wow! Congrats on your new arrival Ticklefish. May peace and joy be yours, despite all of the sleepless nights ahead :) - Tue, 24 Jun 2003 11:28pm | ||
| L.P | Wow.. Congrats to you both...the start of a new chapter, As a mother of a son ,days short of his 19th....I'd give anything to be in your shoes again, the smell, the sounds, oh to feel his teeny butt in my hands again, picking the lint outa his hands ect...I was told by everybody..' they grow up so fast!'...you smile and nod but never realize it until it's too late...cherish every moment!...You've got the best sign 'Cancer' ... very sensitive, family oriented - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 12:52am | ||
| KnifeGhost User Info... | Anyone interested in a board that doesn't suck can come over to http://www.SecretArcade.com in the Victoria section... Right now it's pretty quiet... It's a board sitting almost empty waiting for a crowd..... - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 1:13am | ||
| my secret past | Only good wishes, Ticklefish. To be honest I have no problem with this board and the stuff that goes on. Just as in life, there's always shit, useless shit, nuisance-type stuff you've got to put up with from bored people. I don't sense a lot of outright evil on here, just bored people trying to get a rise out of people. And each time I see something get posted thats derogatory or inflamatory or whatever else, I see tons of cool people speak up and rise against. I find it reassuring. What bothers me sometimes is that people lack a sense of humor so when someone makes a ridiculously sarcastic joke, it gets taken seriously. Crying shame, ingrates lighten things up when things get too serious. I'm all for anon postings, it allows ultimate freedom to throw things out there. We've proven we can handle it. - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 1:25am | ||
| cuntfuck | ticklefish, you take this board a little too seriously. get a fucking lif, homo. deep thought of the day: It takes a big man to cry, but it takes an even bigger man to laugh at that man. - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 1:38am | ||
| Anonymous | - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 1:41am | ||
| Anonymous | My sister just gave birth to a girl on Monday. She's at the General: may be you're wife has seen her? Congrats! ps. My sister gave birth to a, 8lb 8 but her first child was 10 lbs 24 inches! - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:42am | ||
| Just a Thought | To "****####" (your name is not worth repeating!) The thing is... Ticklefish DOES have a life! It's a sad shame that you don't realize this! - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 11:56am | ||
| Anonymous | Yeah ####, you're HUGELY outnumbered here! and dude, try not to take your misery out on others, huh? - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 1:40pm | ||
| ticklefish | awwww.... isn't that sweet, a shit-for-brains crybaby. I always loved guys like you, tons of you back in high school, love to call people "homo", "fag".... back then it was funny because it was their girlfriends who were dumping them for us "fags", now I am telling a story of my wife giving birth to my child, and the best insult you have is "homo"? I don't think there is much in the world that is more "hetero" than having a baby. Fuck, you really are pathetic. - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 5:59pm | ||
| SweetGrass | Ah, I knew it wouldn't last! To ****... Fuck you, you Mother fucker, Cocksucker! The man just had a baby Get a life.! Oh I feel much better now. I see clouds in the sky, must be a shit storm coming! - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 6:04pm | ||
| TRY THIS!! | Excuse me you guys, but "My sister gave birth" had the right idea, just by moving on. The 5 subsequent posters gave the anon ### piece of shit the attention, the rise he/she was so looking for. My suggestion: don't play into it. - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 6:29pm | ||
| Anonymous | I don't think it was even worth responding to, myself. - Wed, 25 Jun 2003 6:32pm | ||
| Sour_Girl User Info... | Marriage is punishment for stealing in some countries - Sat, 28 Jun 2003 5:16pm | ||
| ROSS B AY User Info... | beer. it's my life. it's my wife.... - Sat, 28 Jun 2003 9:33pm | ||
| Zippgunn User Info... | I have always lived my life with the idea that the less I have to do with any form of government or officialdom the happier I will be and this ESPECIALLY goes for the bedroom. The idea of spending thousands of $$ to officially inform the govt. that I'm going to bond with another of their subjects makes no sense to me; add to the fact that my "wife" is a native with status which she could lose if she married a white guy AND that my kids would have no hope of aquiring native status of their own were we actually married sealed the deal. We've been together for 15 or so years now and, yes, I call her my "wife". I think it's none of the government's business what I do or who I do it with. - Sun, 29 Jun 2003 2:27pm | ||
| Jedi User Info... | That's not true anymore. They changed that with bill C31 in the 70's. Children keep status if half or more. If that child married a white person, their kids would lose out. Each band also has their own rules and regulations. Marriage cost could be as low as $100 less name changes and other stuff. A divorse could cost thousands. - Sun, 29 Jun 2003 3:11pm | ||
| Zippgunn User Info... | You're right but unfortunately my kids are only 1/4 native so,,, - Sun, 29 Jun 2003 3:42pm | ||
| METALHEAD!% User Info... | I don't know you zippgunn, so I am not attacking your character, but your post makes it sound like the main reason you don't want to get married is so that you can save money and get tax write offs. - Sun, 29 Jun 2003 3:54pm | ||
| lily_liquor User Info... | Sounds like a good enough reason to me.. - Sun, 29 Jun 2003 5:03pm | ||
| METALHEAD!% User Info... | Hmmm, yeah I guess so. - Sun, 29 Jun 2003 5:20pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | This may sound harsh but... if your kids are only 1/4 Native then they really aren't "Native". They're 3/4 of something else. It's a big stretch for them to claim Native status. That's NOT to say that they should just drop any Native culture that they have but.. basically, it's like I have Polish blood in me, my grandfather fought in the AK in WWII, by gramma was put in a concentration camp, my mom's first language is Polish but me...? I'm just Canadian with 1/4 of Polish in me. How bland. (I'm French/Welsh/Canadian too on my dad's side). This sucks but it's the realtiy of being a third generation Canadian. Oh, and the bill C-whatever is definatly making it more impossible for Natives to retain their status. Just think of it, the bill is making it so that Native status will be eventually a thing of the past (and so will the treaties/tax breaks). - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 10:37am | ||
| Wreaker of Havoc User Info... | Culture should not be based on color or whether or not you are 1/4 3/4 or whatever. There is no major scientific differeces between races so the way I see it culture is more a way of life than how much native blood you have in your veins. A 1/8 native that speaks the native tongue and practices native rituals is more native in my eyes than a 100% native that has no knowlege of his culture. 'Status' is an old 'divide and conquer' policy by the govt. Instead of First Nations people of all colors and mixes acting as one they marginalize 1/4s, 1/8s Metis etc... out of fear of 'thinning the pot' of rights to 'status' Natives. Then thier is the animosity built up towards 'status' natives that have no knowledge of their culture that reap the benifits. Not to mention other ethnic minorities and the white majority grumbling about 'wheres my benifits?'. The working class (all colours) spend all thier time bickering and fighting over 'scraps' the govt throws our way distracting us frome the very real fact that we are getting fucked. Think about it: Native groups get extra fishing rights at the same time fishing license prices go up. Extra money goes to ease asian immigrants into the workplace as the govt lays of 1000's. Funding goes to a mill outside of Vancouver while 5 others close in BC. Not exactly the type of incidents that breed unity..... Yes we have been played like this for generations and will continue to be played for generations to come. Ah the sweet sensation of getting fucked over....oh ya and marriage IS overrated - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 12:21pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | I'm just trying to draw a line b/w race and culture. There is a difference. As I have already said, I think it's cool for a person to practice a culture, but that doesn't make them that race. I sing Polish birthday/Christmas songs, I can make Polish dishes, I can speak cute Polish phrases, but I'm still not Polish. I'm Canadian with a bit of Polish blood who practices little aspects of Polish culture. I don't feel ripped off or anything: my family's bloodline is just changing and change isn't bad. It isn't bad that my kids will not be Polish. Being Canadian isn't inferior to being Polish. Being Candian isn't inferior to being Native. My status is a-o-kay. An example of how practicing a culture will not make you part of that race: My boyfriend knew a girl who for some reason grew up thinking that she was Ukranain. She decided, while in her twenties, that she wanted to learn more about her Ukranian heritage so she started going to festivals, dances, read a lot....eventually knew everything that she possibly could learn about the race/culture/history. Then one day her parents asked her why she was so interested with Ukranes (I can't speell, I mean "spell"). After her saying something about when she was a little girl she was told that they were Ukranian, her parents laughed at her and told her that they were English or French, or something totally different (I can't remember what it was). Absolutly no Ukranian blood in the family line-- not even a drop. So, in her mind (prior) she was Ukranian, for 2 years "practiced" the culture... is she Ukranian? I don't think so. - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 12:34pm | ||
| The Ref User Info... | Wow Wreaker, woke up and added some serious thinking pills to your corn flakes? Very interesting thoughts! And I agree, politics/politicians today bridge on criminal behaviour! At least 50 years ago, you knew you were getting fucked because little was done to hide it. Today, its all image, bows, ribbons and all that bullshit. Shoot one group down and raise another even though the political policies may fall under the same agenda. How'bout that Minister or Adviser/Commission head that paid 35 cents on the dollar for his taxes. I mean holy fuck!!! Talk about some real bumb fucking of the public trust!!! We should all stop paying taxes until the both the Federal and Provincial Governments become more fiscally responsible! Spend the money where they are told to. Salary cap politicians to 50 or 60 Grand per year! No free rides, make sure that their expenditures are for work and nothing else. If they aren't then bill them and take it directly out of their pays! It should be an honour to serve, not a privilidge to follow! Aaaaaahhhh Don't get me started!!!! Oh yea, and Marriage is over rated. People are together and in love, great! Even little ceremonies to commemorate the event is great! Piece of paper means crap and it's just another trap for you to spend money! Divorce is ten times more expensive than marriage. Why? Certainly not because they want you to stay married. Rant rant rant...blah blah blah! Cheers! - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 12:41pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | Hey Wreaker: I guess you can say that we're all united in the fact that we're all fucked!?! hee hee, may be THAT's what it is to be Canadian? I guess I just find it understand how our country in NOT a melting pot, (ex: you're Italian then Canadian, whereas in the States you're American _then_ Italian). I mean, who are we kidding? It only takes 2 generations to mix so many races together that all you're left with is a jummble of cultures which is what we now call "Canadian." I just get irriated with the ranking: I'm a mixture of trash. That's it!!! I'M A CANADIAN!!! - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 12:53pm | ||
| Wreaker of Havoc User Info... | The term 'race' is becoming an extinct term. It actually has no real meaning anymore. 'Races' have become so dilute that most cant even tell what is what anymore. Telling a persons Race tells more about general appearance than any real ethnicity at all. Meaningless. Your Ukraine example is not what I am referring to. Even she doesnt believe she is Ukrainian any more. If she was brought up within the local Ukraine community with a ukrainian family, spoke the language, religion, customs, food etc was her way of life then YES she is ukrainian even if she has not Ukrainian blood. Put her in front of someone who is blind and they will agree. As I said culture is a way of life not dictated by blood or colour. Dont let appearance be your way of judgement. Ex: Take person A a white person 4th generation living in Japan; speaks the language, practices the customs and moves to Canada. Take person B. Visibly asian (Japanese decent? perhaps) 4th generation Canadian. Doesnt speak the language and doesnt even really have a clue about the culture. Now are you going to tell me that person B is Japanese and person A is not. GIVE - YOUR - HEAD - A - SHAKE - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 12:54pm | ||
| The Ref User Info... | Bravo! Our country is a great big melting pot! More so in the East but everywhere there are multi racial communities. Well said some girl! Oh Canada, our home and multi-cultural land... - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 1:02pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | Fuck, Ref, I'm orginally from the East!!!! - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 1:06pm | ||
| Wreaker of Havoc User Info... | Our country is a melting pot that claims its a mosaic. Govt claims a 'multicultural' population but doesnt do much to allow different cultures to flourish in this country without being taken advantage of or exploited. Different cultures are still swallowed up and assimilated into one melting pot. If the govt was serious about 'multiculturalism' it would be spending fierce $$$$ on educating the public about different cultures. Allowing local communities to tailor thier programs to focus on local first nations language/culture training as well as other predominant ethnic groups in certain areas. Parts of Quebec can be taken as an example. - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 1:12pm | ||
| The Ref User Info... | So am I some Girl! And Quebec is a great example Wreaker! The only place in this Country where it's okay to promote it's culture. They do asimulate well there. Immigrants are speaking french very quickly. Montreal is probably the most multi cultural city in this country. Then TO and Van. - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 1:31pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | Since we're kinda opening up our communication channels I guess that I should admit something right now... okay, here it goes.... ... you know when I said that I have French blood on my dad's side of the family? Well, the truth is is that it's French Canadian blood---not France french. Okay, there it is. I said it. I would of told you earlier but, you know, I was just afraid that you'd kick me off the board ... you know, since us Quebec-ers are known pee drinkers/baby eaters. - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 1:37pm | ||
| The Ref User Info... | Hahaha Pee Drinkers/baby eaters! - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 1:56pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | May be we should focus on what this thread was initially about: marriage! May be we could tie the two--> does your culture/the culure of the one you're with stress your relationship? Or does it make it more interesting? Does anyone even care? (this isn't a race question, it's a practicing culure question). Or does culture/passing down culture only really matter when kids are involved? - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 2:03pm | ||
| Zippgunn User Info... | OK to promote its culture?? More like its illegal NOT to promote its culture. One big thing about Quebec for me (a born and bred Van Isle boy) is that it's OK to actively discriminate against people who use one of two official languages to communicate. Meanwhile it's unacceptable to import a beer into Canada unless the word "biere" is on it, even if it's destined for Victoria. Its ILLEGAL to bring up your kids in a Quebec school in english if you're a recent immigrant, illegal to post a business sign in any language other than French (imagine the trouble the language police ould have in Van what with all the Mandarin, Korean signage etc.). The powers that be in Quebec actively promote prejudice against anything that's not French; do the reverse anywhere else in Canada and you'll be violating the rights of Quebecers. I thought we were all equal in Canada? - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 2:08pm | ||
| some girl... User Info... | I like how Kinder (sp?) Eggs give their small parts/choking hazard warning in a dozen different languages! Can you imagine if our cereal boxes did the same? Or gum? - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 2:19pm | ||
| The Ref User Info... | Unfortunately the tyranny that now goes on in Quebec is a result of francaphones having it the other way around for many decades. Now I'm not defending them, but it is the direct cause for such fanatisism in that province. The French language was quashed (publication wise) for so long. No french store signs, all hwy signs were in English only with a majority of French speaking citizens, it had to go the other way. At Expo 67 all the signs were in English...Then DeGaul came along and said "Vivre le Quebec libre"/"Let Quebec be free". The beginning of it all! - Mon, 30 Jun 2003 3:32pm | ||
| Zippgunn User Info... | Well Ref, that was quite a while ago, and in 1971 I was informed (in grade 8) that if I didn't pass French I would fail the entire grade, a situation that, in reverse, would NEVER happen in Quebec, now or then. Also note that, in Europe, almost EVERYTHING has a dozen different languages on it, particularly if it's made in a country that speaks a "minor" language predominantly (say Hungary). I once bought an ice cream stick over there that only had Russian and Arabic on it!!! - Tue, 1 Jul 2003 1:11pm | ||
| The Ref User Info... | Your point being? - Tue, 1 Jul 2003 1:17pm | ||
| Shaggy User Info... | Marriage is bullshit. Don't be a divorce statistic or help the lawyers line their pockets. Common law is just as legal and a lot less hassle if/when it ends. - Tue, 1 Jul 2003 1:21pm | ||
| ROSS B AY User Info... | yeah! i'm going to go tell my girlfriend that right now!!! (anyone got a couch i can crash on for a while?) - Tue, 1 Jul 2003 1:23pm | ||
| Shaggy User Info... | Our couch is quite comfy Zac *eg* - Tue, 1 Jul 2003 1:52pm | ||
| Gman User Info... | Having lived in Quebec, I can safely say: The majority of Quebeckers do not give a shit. Most speak at least 2 languages, may speak 3, especially if they have immigrated from a foreign country. All of the French/English crap is perpetrated by politicians and bigots. Which are you? Gman - Tue, 1 Jul 2003 2:49pm | ||
| The Ref User Info... | Hope that you were't refering to me Gman? I am a Ex-Montrealer and proud of it. I was simply pointing out the cause and effect to someone else's post. You are 100% correct, the propaganda that goes on there is totally perpetrated by polititians and media mogels that want to seperate (thus my meaning of tyranny). Further more, the rest of the countries media, (run by the opposite minded with the same sort of aganda) does the same everywhere else by telling people that quebecers all hate the rest of English Canada! This is not true! Thanks for the eye opener for those that don't know. Quebec is a great, friendly, multi-lingual province with much charm and ethnic diversity. Pretty much everyone gets along fabulously there! TY - Tue, 1 Jul 2003 4:34pm | ||
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