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band in a box
| Message Board > Gear Buy & Sell > band in a box |
| bones User Info... | Lookin for Band in a Box. If someone has a cracked version etc. I'd appreciate the help. Thanks - Sun, 18 Feb 2007 6:44pm | ||
| Gman User Info... | Band-in-a-Box is produced by PG Music Inc., a Victoria company, and I work for them so I can't say I'm too impressed with your post asking for participation in your illegal activities. Also, having your Shaw email address and (presumably) your telephone number in your profile is pretty idiotic if you're doing this. I always find it interesting that these posts are tolerated (also see the Ableton Live thread), but were I to post asking for stolen gear, everyone would be up in arms... If you'd like instructions on how to get a legitimate copy at a good price, I'd be happy to help. - Sun, 18 Feb 2007 7:18pm Edited: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 7:20pm | ||
| bones User Info... | Hey Gman. I understand your opinion totally. So give me the lowdown on how to get a copy for a reasonable price. - Sun, 18 Feb 2007 7:29pm | ||
| Gman User Info... | I sent an email to the address in your profile. If that's not correct, let me know where I can send it. - Sun, 18 Feb 2007 7:59pm | ||
| Broham User Info... | Gman I find it interesting that you find that interesting. Its fine your against pirate software that makes sense its very reasonable. But heres the difference. Stolen gear People lose out that was somebodys guitar and now they can't play it. Stolen software Companies are losing out on potential sales. In other words pirated software is sticking it to the man. Im not gunna say im all for it (I kinda dont care good music is what I care about.) If some music company is getting bummed out because someone is re-producing their (non-art) product to make art. I mean its not right. But it makes sense that its mostly accepted by a community of artists. Its not even paint and paper. Its someones Ideas and someones work yes. But its almost a package deal now. For example there are additional levys on cd-rs and dvds to compensate for the loss in profit due to pirate music and films. The other argument I have an easier time understanding is why does one person deserve something for free that someone else has to pay for. I appreciate your opinion theres just alot of ins and outs. And you should treat it as such. Stealing music is almost objectively much worse then stealing software. Do any your friends steal music? And are you hard on all of them? thanks - Sun, 18 Feb 2007 8:20pm Edited: Sun, 18 Feb 2007 8:21pm | ||
| Gman User Info... | This discussion should be moved before we continue it. Also, I just typed a brilliant reply and the board seemed to die on me while posting it, yar. So I'm going to ask it be moved to C&Q before I go through all that again... but trust me, it'll be worth it! - Sun, 18 Feb 2007 10:11pm | ||
| Tim-Bitchfork User Info... |  | ||
| TheWolf User Info... | RE:. Stealing music is almost objectively much worse then stealing software. Do any your friends steal music? And are you hard on all of them? Stealing Software is way worse than stealing music. The Software company invests way more money in making and supporting the program than most Record Albums,with no other forms of revenue (No concert listings for Photoshop Tours, Or ProTools T-shirts for sale to make up money) That "stolen music" causes people to go to concerts , buy merchandise and buy the album if they really like it... Plus the CRIA story linked here shows that Quote: In summary, CRIA's own research now concludes that P2P downloading constitutes less than one-third of the music on downloaders' computers, that P2P users frequently try music on P2P services before they buy, that the largest P2P downloader demographic is also the largest music buying demographic, and that reduced purchasing has little to do with the availability of music on P2P services. I've argued many of these same things, but now you don't have to take my word for it; you can take it from the record labels themselves. http://michaelgeist.ca/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1168&Itemid=85 - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 1:08am | ||
| Broham User Info... | "For me all these kinds of things, these interests and considerations, come out of a general impetus to make art in general." -mayo theres my head to head quote I didnt really want to share an opinion either way. I just think you have to consider it on a personal level. When you steal from the companys your stealing a tool to make art. When you steal from the artist. Your robbing what is ideally some sort of personal expression or gesture. I dont think you KNOW which of either one worse. Atleast on a personal level. As in guilt. As far as who is losing more money. Maybe its the companys but companys and artists are very different. I hate people who don't have artistic impulses. (I think the worlds problems consist of a lack of art in people and a general comfort found in money. Its a self-perpetuating system of being comfortable to the point where people have no imagination.) But that doesn't mean I hate buisnessmen. They are entitled to their impulses and my respect just as much as anyone. But Money is not synomymous with music. Many people I know should learn that. My intention is to introduce a second of two important perspectives. Im not that interested in debating them. Intentions often seem to be lost on these message boards. Thanks though - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 3:00am | ||
| Gman User Info... | Damnit, I knew I shouldn't have written another post before the thread moved. Same error just killed my reply again. Anyway, Broham, PG Music is a company made up largely of musicians. It was started by a musician. It is music software to help musicians. It was introduced in 1988 at $88. It still sells at $88. Most music software is started as a labour of love. Unfortunately, when 1,000,000 people want to share, and ask that you spend most of your time coming up with new ways of having the software help you explore music, it's not a labour for a single person. That is why many companies begin. You making them faceless is simply convenient for you so you can pass these judgments without considering their humanity. I work with them so I can eat. When someone takes the software without paying, it's not some amorphous concept, it's food out of my mouth. THANKS A LOT. Truly creative people are creative because they are creative not because they have money or don't have money or eat or don't eat or have arms or don't have arms. If a person's creativity is dulled by their environment or situation, perhaps they're not truly creative. I don't find that you're introducing a perspective at all, simply setting out some generalizations which dehumanize people. --- Most of my friends are musicians, and we do all make our own CDs, burn CDs, buy CDs, etc. We all know what it's about. My non-musician friends and family also know and certainly don't exclusively burn CDs, no. Either way, I really don't know a lot of people who don't have creative impulses - probably in large part because I would find them extraordinarily boring. --- If you would really like to get into non-mediated art (money can be considered a mediator between the artist and the audience), I'd suggest reading Hakim Bey's essays on Immediatism if you haven't already. - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 7:20am | ||
| Gman User Info... | Oh, and I do understand the difference between a copyable medium and a physical object. But instead of thinking of someone stealing a guitar, think of it as someone stealing your practice time. There's always more time, right? - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 7:27am | ||
| ::Saint:: User Info... | Here's a wacky concept - "Artistic Impulses" are not limited to writing or playing music. Not everyone in the world was built to be a musician, or a painter, or a novelist (I happen to be a musician and a novelist, but whatever hehe). How is it any less creative or "artistic" to write software? I've known people, perhaps people like Gman, though I don't know him specifically that I am aware of, who have talents I could only ever dream of, except that their talents involve intricate bits of code and program sequencing, which culminate in software that WORKS and does wonderful things. By stealing that software, you are, in fact, stealing something just as creative and precious as downloaded music or the like. Don't put "art" in a box just because that box happens to be shaped like your own artistic leanings - it doesn't belong there. - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:14am | ||
| Soap Dodger User Info... | Software sales help cover the monthly overhead needed to run a company: rent, payroll, bandwidth, hardware, software licenses for development, marketing, hydro bills, network infrastructure, etc. If the company can't make ends meet, employees get laid off. If enough people steal the software as opposed to purchasing it, you're taking away someone's job - not "sticking it to the man". In this case the employee is a musician, so you could potentially be taking away the opportunity for them to afford a guitar and make music. - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:56am | ||
| mica User Info... | i think there is a lot to be said for "time-limited" full function demos. if you try something and you like it...buy it. - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 11:16am | ||
| Broham User Info... | Anyway, Broham, PG Music is a company made up largely of musicians. It was started by a musician. It is music software to help musicians. It was introduced in 1988 at $88. It still sells at $88. -Yeah, PG music seems cool Most music software is started as a labour of love. Unfortunately, when 1,000,000 people want to share, and ask that you spend most of your time coming up with new ways of having the software help you explore music, it's not a labour for a single person. That is why many companies begin. -Yes You making them faceless is simply convenient for you so you can pass these judgments without considering their humanity. -I don't think you understood. I work with them so I can eat. When someone takes the software without paying, it's not some amorphous concept, it's food out of my mouth. THANKS A LOT. -I personally don't condone or use pirated software. Truly creative people are creative because they are creative not because they have money or don't have money or eat or don't eat or have arms or don't have arms. If a person's creativity is dulled by their environment or situation, perhaps they're not truly creative. -In a sense I agree. I just think that it makes sense when all these people who just wanna make records consider the non-artistic aspects of it insignifigant. I know I care most about the record itself. Not how it was made. You don't see how alot of people feel that way? I don't find that you're introducing a perspective at all, simply setting out some generalizations which dehumanize people. -I think perhaps my (very open-ended) ideas are beyond your comprehension. It exists. Your coming from a view that completely ignores why people do it in the first place. Do you understand? --- Most of my friends are musicians, and we do all make our own CDs, burn CDs, buy CDs, etc. We all know what it's about. -far out. My non-musician friends and family also know and certainly don't exclusively burn CDs, no. -Do you condone pirating music to some degree? I dont understand. Either way, I really don't know a lot of people who don't have creative impulses - probably in large part because I would find them extraordinarily boring. -Me neither, I hate them have you turned on the Television? --- If you would really like to get into non-mediated art (money can be considered a mediator between the artist and the audience), I'd suggest reading Hakim Bey's essays on Immediatism if you haven't already. -I'll read it thanks. I suggest listening to John Cage 4'33". It is a perspective one you may be suprised is more common then your own I think. How does one justify pirating software to oneself? Thats an interesting question. - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 1:35pm Edited: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 1:38pm | ||
| Tim-Bitchfork User Info... | hmmm, not sure where I stand on this. I think PG Music deserves the price they charge, a local company and I've used the software a few years back, it was really cool. Although I am writing this from a pirated Windows XP machine. Then again, MS doesn't deserve a dime of my money for this sad piece of crap they call an OS. I recently got a pirated earlier version of Pro Tools, just before they started doing the USB key thing and tried it out. I liked how it worked, read up on the newer version and bought the newest version at L+M. I think it is possible for software companies to stay profitable when they have the right means of authentication and anti-piracy. Of course people will get around it, but if you can limit that then your doing good. - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 3:57pm | ||
| bones User Info... | Wow!! Look what I started. I kinda had a feeling this might happen when I started this post, mostly 'cause I was aware PG Music is a local company. I didn't have to wait long. Firstly let me congratulate everyone who has responded so far. You have all behaved like actual adults. No name calling or unnecessary profanity. Quite impressive really. Experience has shown me from other posts that there are many who frequent this site who's most obvious 'creative impulse' is to name call and swear. Your absence is appreciated. Secondly, since I started all this I guess I should offer some kinda statement. I don't condone stealing in any of it's multitude of forms. Stealing is bad for the soul and that's where music comes from. Hopefully. The best argument for me against thievery is not because it may or may not harm some other but because it will definately harm me. It is a violation against who I believe myself to be. That being said I also believe in some sorta karma. If I decide to take that which is not mine then I also am very clear that it will not go unpunished. My experience is that punishment comes in more forms than does thievery. - Mon, 19 Feb 2007 4:24pm | ||
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